Dave

Agreed

As you may know, I’m leaving Talnivarr and the guild, because of this drama. It’s a farce. I’m sad as I’ve had a lot of fun with this guild in the past – but not that much in recent times. At the time of the discord drama, there were a lot of attempts to make it more welcoming – the distant worlds thing was a misunderstanding as people did not know you weren’t using the server Sarah – you were even the first person tagged. Even the most recent incident was because we saw you active on the list and assumed you were active. We even went so far as changing owners back then - but yet we’re still not trusted? The exact same people use our discord as use our forums and the guild. However, a lot of stuff was said by you about our intentions in the thread that followed, but an apology was never issued. It hurt, but I tried to leave it behind, but every time you took umbrage about something to do with discord it came roaring back – especially now when you’ve made it clear you use other discords, but not with us In defence of Mark, if you were being told you were the baddy or lashed out at unpredictably (see classic character server thread), would you not eventually lose patience? In all my interactions with him he hasn’t held ill-will. When discussing mage play it was to help get everyone able to do M15s. I feel Mark has been unfairly targeted as others have said things similar to what he has said but not received such treatment. I’m afraid that I feel the opportunities to resolve this has been missed. Sorry should have been said a long time ago.

I cannot believe this is still an issue, and I no longer have the time or the patience. Goodbye

Any preferences for this week?

Please let me know what keys y'all have tomorrow, and your availability for Thursday/Monday - with a preference if you have one

In the interests of being open and honest and with a view to trying to clear the air once and for all. I’m just going to throw my thoughts out here. Replying to Tom’s post first: #1 Social issues The guild is a lot quieter at present – and it’s mostly down to us having 10 (9 soon) active players. But people are a fair bit quieter on GChat when they’re on anyway. But I think that’s due to us getting into the habit of idling on discord voice if/when folks are on as it’s just easier? We don’t have a base of people on idling as most folk are only able to be on for a few hours at a time max, and even then, only on specific days – days on which we have activities planned so most communication takes place on discord/TS voice Also – I feel like discord text has mostly replaced guild chat and the bulk of forum posting? We idly chat away about nonsense like in Gchat but plan stuff like on the forums. I like using it because I can poke at it easily on my phone whenever as I also use discord for a lot of other things. It would be nice if everyone was there participating because I don’t want to leave anyone out but I also don’t want to have to post things multiple times in order to cover everyone? #2 Pushing people away Honestly - A lot of this could be a holdover from issues that have occurred previously - such as the great discord explosion. Some issues have never really been put to bed and we haven't really drawn a line under it and it’s lead to some lingering grievances which can occasionally surface – such as an incident on the forums last year when we were discussing classic servers. It can feel like I have to walk on eggshells sometimes and that is very, very draining. And negativity seems to be the default attitude within the guild and it isn’t helpful and has maybe added to this and it’s a self-fulfilling prophecy? I know I’ve occasionally been snarky in some runs but a lot of that is because I’ve been frustrated that I just couldn’t seem to be getting things going for the guild. Now that we’re just focusing on M+ it should improve. One thing that really gets to me is what I can perceive to be complaints about the way M+ runs are allocated or organised – I know you may not intend it that way but it’s very easy for me to interpret it personally when I’m just trying to get everyone runs and it sucks because I overthink it. Please speak up in advance about what preferences are otherwise I’ll be trying to do things in order to get the highest level of keys for everybody – saying ‘I’m good for whatever’ doesn’t help as much as you think So please – try and be positive? #3 Disagreement over effort This is less of an issue now. Previously the M+ system didn’t really offer anything beyond tens so we got into a rut of just doing the motions of our ten with no real motivation. Folk now seem to be putting a bit more effort in and doing things like simming etc to improve performance and reviewing runs afterwards. Hopefully our new plan of fixing M+ groups each week will allow for more runs and more consistency while also allowing people to use their time effectively if they know they’re not running. I’m sad we’re not doing the heroic raid – but unless we get a few more people back it’s not really feasible as I do not have the energy to deal with puggies. #4 abandon ship I'd rather not abandon the guild as it's got a lot of history and it would be nice to welcome people back if they return to characters long abandoned - but if people think that's best then we should probably start shopping around for a suitable guild that wouldn't mind taking on a pile of socials. Not even sure where to begin there Personally I was hoping we could get some crossover with the guys playing classic and provide a nice home to people wanting to play retail when shadowlands drops Finally - I should also point out that I have server transferred my Paladin to Argent Dawn (H) but this is more to have a character I can play with my friend Kat in her guild’s social raids on a regular basis.

Am sad, but understand. Hope your hop is a success

Monday will be focusing on the folks who didn't run Thursday but we'll see what happens after that. In terms of gear - I'd recommend not stockpiling residuum for the top level pieces until you have a good set of 460s. Also if you can get mask runs of visions going, they drop good gear too with guaranteed corruptions next week

Proposal going forward is to use Thursdays and Mondays for m+. With set groups for each day being allocated on Wednesday once we've seen the keys. Hopefully this will allow a consistent set of pushing runs each night and allow those not on for m+ that night to do other things without having to keep availability open. Since you'll know what keys will be available, routes can be planned or forgotten mechanics looked up - allowing for better progress Also for higher keys we should be bringing consumables, including health potions, as on tyrannical they can save your life given the damage going out

Not going to be using Thursdays for the raid anymore this patch unless we can get more active members

I carry 3 specs worth of azerite already + trinkets - so not too much extra burden to me lol

Question - does this have to be monday? Or are people who are available monday able to switch to tuesdays? Just idly ruminating

So with BWL coming, the classic lads aren't about on Monday. Any suggesttions for another day to add in to the rotation to ensure inclusion? also we just need to get more runs in - getting 15s will require a lot of runs

Agreed, route planning has always been one of our weaknesses. I suppose it felt like we'd done enough given the amount of neutral crap we pulled 😛

What's people's thoughts on our approach to raiding this patch. Personally I've had very little interest in doing them more than once or twice as we outgear normal handily after a week or two of m+. I'd like to propose we just keep extending lockouts and work our way through normal twice or so to learn it, then take our time and do heroic together as that would mean a lot to me Otherwise we'll basically stop raiding for an age as people have very little incentive to do normal

So with the new season and more than 5 people on at once - we probably need to have a think about M+ monday and how it'll work. There's two main breakpoints: 10 for residuum - after which point the rewards increase more slowly 15 for gear For those who aren't aware - there's now an achievement, title and mount for completing all 15s in time - personally this is my goal but it's going to be hard and require a lot of work, likely equivalent to or more than working through the heroic raid. Therefore - what are people wanting to use M+ mondays for - because I know people have expressed concern about this level of commitment before? I see two options - we use M+ mondays to make sure anyone interested in just getting a 10+ their keys, then switching to or finding another day for those interested in 15s Or we use M+ monday to push keys as hard as we can - with the agreement that people bring flasks, food, pots and runes , and ensure they're familiar with the new affix, routes etc Thoughts?

Let's just leave it till next week there's no rush on meta content - I'm basically on a break until 8.3 anyway XD

I'm on-call this Thursday so will be working late and then liable to get pulled away so no point me being on - feel free to log on and do other things though, but tomb meta will be next week sorry

I'd rather not proceed without anyone so we'll park it for today, there's no rush

Anyone not about? As I've said above theres no point really going unless the people who want metas are all here

Cool, there's no point going for metas without everyone - see you all next week

That's my only concern - that changed mechanics might make achievements more difficult

Next Thursday we will do the antorus meta achievement https://www.wowhead.com/glory-of-the-argus-raider-achievement-guide See you all then

Cool, I think my only request for meta runs would be that people look up the guides in advance to save on time with explanations. I'd probably start with legion and work backwards?

How would people feel about going back and doing old meta achievements with our Thursdays occasionally?